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Show Notes:

Beck: Lovely ones, I’m so excited to invite you into this chat for this particular podcast episode with one of my favourite people in the history of the world. I have with me, Allie Daddo. And I need to be totally honest with you about how this conversation has come about.

Some years after Alli, came back into my life now. She didn’t know she was in my life. But as a 15-year-old, I used to read Dolly magazine, religiously, I had every single issue. And Ali was often a cover model and I wanted to be her. But look, let’s just be honest, I am not a supermodel actually is I wasn’t blessed with her face, hair and legs.

And so I was just kind of relegated to reading the pages of Dali and thinking that she was the best thing since sliced bread.

Because you’re gorgeous. And I just felt like at the time that you are a really,  beautiful human being. So we were kind of friends when I was 15. You didn’t know that much. We were and then one day, what happened was, Ali, commented on my Instagram page, and I lost my sheet and
found guilty in her DMS I slid into her DMS and I was like, Oh my god, I love you so much.

I had every issue with you on the cover of delay, you’re amazing, blah, blah, blah. And a couple of years later, I can tell you that I was right. She is a ridiculously beautiful human being inside and out. And I get the pleasure of calling her a friend and I get to talk to her today with you
about boundaries. And I just think it’s really important that I want to say it out loud that sometimes you shouldn’t meet your heroes, you know, sometimes you really shouldn’t meet them in real life because they’re just not nice human beings.

And when I met you and we started to form a friendship and mainly via Instagram DMS, which still continues today for those of you listening  –  Ali’s in Sydney, and I’m in Queensland.

I just you constantly make me want to be a better human being like I just your allyship for Black Lives Matter and for first Australians. And your, your general compassion for human beings and wanting to be a better version of yourself is something that just constantly inspires me. And she’s joining us today listeners as the host, the co-host Actually, I’m not going to ignore cam as the co-host of a top-rated podcast called Separate Bathrooms with her husband, Cameron Daddo.

I just love that you’re here. I love that we get to have this conversation.

Ali: Oh, holy cow. Oh, so much. You know, I love you. 

Beck: I love you too. And before we start though, what have I missed? From your bio? Can you explain to listeners who you are in the world what you do, what your impact is? 

Ali: Well, yeah, so after I gave up muddling it. Gosh, how old was I probably about 21 I’m now 51.

So moved to America and with my husband and I ended up becoming what I always dreamed of becoming which was a preschool teacher, an early childhood teacher.

That’s what I always wanted to be I those two things I wanted to be a mom and working with early childhood because my passion is kids always has been always will be.

But before I actually got to that point, I actually was working with pregnant women and their partners and doing pre-birth work and post-birth work as well and assisting in the birth.

The process to make the birth process and much more. Just a really beautiful experience like it. I was really shocked when I became pregnant about the number of horror stories that people wanted to tell me.

Speaking of boundaries, I should have stopped people right there in their tracks before they launched into Oh my God, my best friend died in childbirth. It’s like, Okay, I’m six months.

This is not what I want to hear. Yeah, no. Okay. Yeah. And so I just was really surprised because it had been something I’ve been so passionate about and wanting my entire life. I was like, Okay, this is what I want to do. I want to be able to assist couples to have a really as good as experienced as I possibly could. So I got into that line of work for years, which I just loved.

And then, yeah, then I ended up transitioning into teaching and becoming an early childhood teacher in America. And then four years later, we moved back to Australia.

So I was there for 25 years, moved back to Australia, and was not sure what I was going to do.

Really wasn’t sure was really, it’s a very, very lost very, very challenging, challenging time.

And I’ve ended up going back to teaching. And now I work in primary schools. I work in two different schools, one school, I work with kids on the autism spectrum. And with behavioural disorders and another school, I’m just I’m the Learning Support teacher.

And then yeah, we have our podcast, Cam and I have our podcast, which is about relationships and how to stay together, or what tips have you learned. You know, what are the challenges and the bottom line, it’s about love.

But it’s Yeah, it’s how to be better in relationships, really. So that kind of sums it up. I’m also an ambassador, which I’m really proud of.

I’m the ambassador and homewares, organisation organiser for rising up, which is a Queensland charity, which helps families of domestic abuse and we rehome them and give them a brand new start in life.

Beck: I love all the colours in the tapestry that is Ali Daddo. I think you forgot one because I don’t think you truly believe that you’ve actually done this! Listeners Ali is an author.

Beck: And her book is coming out in March next year, is that correct? Right. Yep. So Ali has written a whole book, something that many people don’t even want to do, but they don’t ever achieve because it’s a mammoth task. And I think, am I correct in assuming that you struggle to call yourself a writer or an author, even though you’ve finished that book?

Ali: Yeah, I do. I, I guess because it hasn’t. It’s, there’s something when I think about being an author, or a writer, and I actually have it in my bio on my Instagram page. And I remember putting it in the bio and going “Can I actually could I say that about myself?” And I’ve been writing for many years.

I’ve written articles for many magazines, but I don’t consider does that make me a writer? Because I haven’t written a book? And, you know, yeah, it’s still kind of catches me for some reason.

And it’s, um, I guess, because it hasn’t, I don’t know, it’s because it hasn’t been released yet. I mean, it’s going to be released, they’ve actually like, it’s, it’s with the publishers it’s happening. But can you call yourself an author if you’ve only written one book? Like it’s this whole mindset that I have of like, Well, does that?

I don’t know. It’s some hang-up that I have it that you have to be like, you know, JK Rowling’s to call yourself an author or something or like you you’ve written four books or something now, you know, so it’s a weird one. It’s just a weird one to own it because for some reason that one for me.

Beck: it’s so interesting, isn’t it like you. You have so many parts to your identity that makes the richness that is you and yet this one huge achievement is something that’s really difficult for you to land on.

And I remember having the same kind of questions in my head before I ever wrote a book which was can I even call myself a writer? Because it felt almost like I was a bit of a fraud you know, like I I was looking for external validation around my words like unless someone significant reads my words, and I think I was made Seeing a significant person, either another published author, or a publisher.

So unless they read my words and say that they’re good, then I can’t even call myself a writer like nothing. The process of actually writing wasn’t acceptable enough. Yeah, yeah. And then when I got a book contract, I did exactly the same thing and changed my Instagram bio. And I was like, fuck. Is this real? And now?

I’m not sure. I’m not sure if it gets easier. I’m not sure if the owning of the title gets easier. I think perhaps I just stopped thinking about it. Because I’m too busy to think about that particular word, until someone introduces me like this.

Ali: And your last, your last book, the one that’s just come out, you’re setting boundaries. That’s Yeah, that was a big deal for you, hasn’t it? Because that’s been like a big chunky book for you.

Beck: Yeah. So that’s my first kind of self help book, which means it’s like, four times the size of any of the books that I’ve written. But I do think that when we when we think about own identity, I just I just wonder whether it’s a case that women have been really socialised to not claim their strengths and not claim their achievements.

And so I look at you and go, don’t forget the fact that you’re NOFA. Like, I mean, seriously, like, Can we talk about these like, this is really important. You’ve written a whole book, and it’s coming out next year, and I’m not gonna stop talking about it. They’re going Holy shit, let’s not say that out loud.

Because is it? Is it real? I do. I wonder if that’s like a feminine thing. we’ve, we’ve been socialised to be quiet about that. And I don’t want to be quiet about that. Because I think you’ve not only have you done it, but you’ve also written on a really important topic, which is menopause.

Yes. And as someone whose boobs are currently hurting, so let’s, I’m just going to be really honest about that. Yeah, boobs are hurting. And I’m not pregnant. Let’s be clear about that as well, because it’s pretty hard to be accidentally pregnant when you have a wife. And I have had thoughts recently at the age of 42. Now, is this the beginning of something that’s changing? And you know, it’s less scary.

Because I have you in my world? I don’t know why. But he’s written a book on it. So I can just talk to her about it. Yeah. I mean, we are going to get to a conversation about boundaries listeners just came by, but my boobs more important right now. Always more important.

Ali: They come first, right?

Beck: But I want to talk about in terms of the impact that you’re making. I just, I just want to say out loud, I just think it’s a really important work that you’ve done, because not only have you been vulnerable enough to write on that topic, but he you are now putting yourself out on the line to bring that topic into the light. So me and my boobs, thank you.

 

Ali: Well, it’s so funny. Because it is it was I was writing and I was like, oh, wow, it’s full circle for me. Because when I was 26, having my first baby and like I’ve mentioned before about all the horror stories I was told about birth and pregnancy and what have you.

Here I am going into, you know, a few years ago going into perimenopause, and I was like, Look, go What is that? Like? I only ever heard negative things about menopause. And if you Google it, it is a world of pain.

Like I almost suggest you don’t Google sometimes. Yeah, we know because it is just horrific, like the amount of symptoms that they give you. And look, that is all true. You can get all those symptoms, but like anything else, women cruise through it without any issues.

But the thing that I wanted to really focus on with menopause, is that a talk about it, because it can be unbelievably challenging.

No one’s talking about it, because we’ve got some kind of embarrassment and fear around it because it’s the end of something. It’s the end of my femininity, it’s the end of my sexuality, people aren’t going to find me attractive anymore.

I’m no longer bearing children. Like there’s this whole thing wrapped up in that. And I went through it all I was in deep mourning about it and I felt like a dried up crispy old piece of toast and I just was like, Whoa, this is really intense.

But I was at the same time going there has to be more like your body doesn’t just do this. And like takes you one step closer to your death. And that’s it like that’s the reason for it as like No way, there is a deeper meaning to this there has to be. And there is in the deeper meaning is so fantastic.

Because there’s so much freedom, there’s so much power. And when I started to talk to women on the other side of menopause, in general, almost across the board, everyone went, it’s fantastic. And I’m having the best time of my life. I feel like I’ve talked about boundaries.

It’s the first time I’ve been able to say no, it’s the first time I put myself first. It’s the first time I’ve been able to do exactly what I want to do with my body with my life. And I’m like, this is what we need to be talking about.

This is what women need to know about menopause, that it’s not just horrific and horrible. And yeah, talk about those things. Own those things. Don’t just jump over how tough it is, though, we need to talk about it in the wholeness.

So we’re not so bloody terrified of it. So that was that was my reasoning for wanting to write about it so much.

Beck: So it’s almost like a gateway to freedom.

Ali: Yeah. Sounds kind of magical. To me, it has totally been that for me as well, like, which has been really exciting. I have been my entire life, someone that has always put myself at the bottom of the ladder. I’ve not had good boundaries.

And I’ve said yes to things I should have said no to and no to things I should have said yes to and, and a lot of that comes from modelling actually, you know, when you are a model, and the only thing they want you for is your image.

They don’t want to know what you think that I want to know what you feel. They don’t want you to talk.

They just want you to look pretty. And so you get trained in that. And I was trained in that from 16 years old that that’s what I had to do. And they’re like, yep, it’s a bikini and it’s five degrees outside, out.

You go. They’re all in the foot like gloves, hat mittens, And they ‘say think warm!’ And you’re in a bikini, phrasing your ass off and it’s like, okay, I’ll do it.

You know, like those kinds of things that you just override constantly, constantly, constantly. So it’s taken me a long time to undo that. And it’s been around menopause that it’s kicked into full gear. It’s like not doing it.

Does not want to do that. Saturday night has out been invited out honey cam says that he hadn’t wanted to do that. I actually don’t know eyes. Okay, good. Do you have, another time this Saturday not into it’s like he’s like, Oh, all right. So yeah, a lot of good things have come from it for me.

Beck: So you’re telling me that menopause has strengthened your boundaries. I feel like I’ve missed out we should have had this conversation prior to me writing the book because I wrote nothing about menopause.

Menopause has strengthened your boundaries. How much has that got to do with just general ageing? Because I don’t know about you. But I love getting older. It’s, I feel so much more comfortable as a human being. And so much more comfortable to say this is not for me. I don’t I don’t need to please you but it doesn’t please me. So see you later.

Ali: Yeah, yeah, I think it’s both. I think it’s ageing. And of course, with ageing comes menopause. Yeah. So yeah, though, I find because menopause is such an internal experience of what is internally going on in your body. And it is a time to really focus on that you really need to or I did anyway, I had to really dig deep into going, what is happening? What is this massive weight gain? What is this? You know, why am I growing a beard?

Beck: Same?

Ali: It’s just like, okay, we need to just, like, let’s go internal for a minute, what the hell is happening? And so that’s what made me go, Okay, I need to just step up a lot of self care right now and move myself through this period of time and give myself the time to feel everything I’m feeling and mourn the losses that I’m feeling.

Ali: And so yeah, it was through that, that I went, yeah, I just, if I don’t want to do it, I don’t have to do it. I don’t have to go there or say that or be that or so it was really helpful for me.

Beck: So as someone who is doing a million things, as well as being a wife and the mother to three gorgeous, almost adult children, to our to their one. How did you manage to draw boundaries around you enough to be able to write a book because writing a book is a somewhat introspective process it’s a it’s quite a lonely process, no one can do it for you.

And it takes a lot of time and sometimes a lot of time doing nothing. You know, like, there’s a lot I don’t know about you, but often there’s a lot that happens in the back of my head before I actually sit down to write and some days when I sit down to write, nothing happens. Like it’s, it’s just a wave pool of frustration.

Ali: 100% and then, I’ve got to sit down and I go, Okay, I’ll give my self half an hour of just like searching out how to speak giraffe. And then, and then I’ll start writing. Okay, now I’ve gone on to another video of like, how to clap your hands 20 times.

While not looking at the I just don’t think that’s like, Oh, God. And then, um, yeah, I found the whole process. Super, super challenging. And, and really, but I loved it. At the same time, I really did love it, I had to. There were times that I just had to go to the library.

I mean, that was the only place I could go. And that was really helpful and put my earphones in and listen to meditation music and just go do that. Or I’d lock myself away.

Actually, in the room I’m in right now where I where there’s like a Do Not Disturb sign on the door.

And just hope that that would and again, I could only do it with my earphones in where I could block out the outside noise because if I could hear a crash in the kitchen, or the dogs barking or Mom, where’s my left sock, then I’d be like pulled out of it. So, um, and the worst person who interrupted me was my husband. He was like, thinking like any just a little gentle knock on the door. Oh, honey, and it’s like

Beck: The gentle knock is still a knock mate!

Ali: I’m still in here like whether you by Gino gentle knock. It’s like honey, honey, I’m just oh my god. Anyways, so I had to define those boundaries more than once. Like it was an over and over and over thing where and

Beck: how did you do it? Did you do it? Like physically with the door in the sign? Or did you do it verbally in a conversation as well?

Ali: Every way I could think I’d announce it. I would masking tape their mouths I tied him to a chair. Yeah, no, I would. Yeah, I’d announce it first. And then I’d be like, Okay, did you get that I’m I can’t be available until I come out of that room. I’m unavailable. Okay, got it, man.

Got it. And the kids would go to and cam eventually. And then I’m like, I’m in that room. And I’m closing the door. That’s what I’m doing. If the phone rings I’m not available. Okay, got it. So yeah, I had to and it was again, I almost have to do it every exercise. I did do it every single time.

Because just if I closed the door, they didn’t know. Yeah, I was just having a snooze or, you know, scrolling Instagram, whatever it was. So yeah, every time I had to announce, I’m going to write even though sometimes I wouldn’t write I was so that

Beck: Was gonna be my next question is boundaries with the family? Um, he’s one thing I’ve certainly struggled with a three year old. Pulling the handle of the locked door going. door is locked.

Yeah, it’s locked for a reason Baba like it’s locked her reason. But that’s one thing once you’re in your space, and you’ve carved out that time, and you’ve carved out, but mainly the silence of the and I’m talking about kind of the existential noise of other people wanting you and the demands from them.

Once you’ve gotten yourself away from that, what about your boundaries internally to actually write because that’s something that I really struggle with, I can check my email. I can I can make all sorts of mental gymnastics happen that make everything else more important than the actual writing itself. Because ultimately,

I’m just a Mexican food eating slop. Like my brain does not like effort and writing is really laborious for me. It’s not easy. I don’t. I don’t actually like it. A lot of people are really surprised when I say this, but I don’t like writing. I like the outcome. Yeah, right. Right. So for listeners, when we started this conversation, it was the best ever because Allie comes on screen.

She’s holding my setting boundaries book up, and I absolutely love you for that because I love the outcome. I love holding something going Holy shit. I sat there long enough to get these concepts out of my head and down onto a piece of paper. Yeah, through that process.

I actually really suck at managing my I own distraction. And so I want to know, what are your internal boundaries? How do you? How do you get it out of you onto the screen or onto the page without doing a million other things like teaching-learning giraffe language?

Ali: Well, I completely relate to what you’re saying and 100% agree. And also, I’m quiet, I’m actually a very creative person like I always have been, I love to draw paint knit.

And I love to do that, because I can do it around people. And I’ve always been someone that likes to do it in the middle of the living room and chat at the same time. And that’s why I love knitting because I can sit watching TV with my kids and knit at the same time.

So this idea of locking myself away on my own, was really hard. And it was gone. It was while I was in this deeply lonely place that I was writing it as well. So and but it was the only way as you know, to write, I, for me anyway, and I think you’re saying the same thing that I had to be on my own, in order to write I had to have that process of quietness.

And once I started, I started catching on to the idea that when I would sit down, I would drift into all sorts of other things other than writing, I actually put a timer on. And when, okay, I’m going to give you half an hour, 20 minutes, or whatever it is, of going of drifting.

And then you need to write. So I’ve had that timer of giving myself that like, like, mental just white noise of whatever it was, I wanted to look at. Yeah, and then go Alright, here we go with that, because and my boundary was this meditation, music things in the 80s. Shut down every other app.

Open. Yeah. And then start writing and, and also giving myself the out of like, if it’s only a sentence, it’s only a sentence. Or if it’s just a bit of research, if you’ve just like googled something, which I shouldn’t say, Google, but if you’ve looked at a book, if you’ve, you know, looked at sort of what does what does this mean? And what does that mean?

And you’ve put that in your notes for your research, you’ve done something and give yourself a pat on the back. So that way, I didn’t sort of keep beating myself up that I hadn’t done anything. So I could come back the next day, and go,

That’s all right, you’ve got something done. It’s okay. So that was that was where I got to, but it took me a while to get to that. But I really recognise that need of, I could so hard to just switch on your creativity. But on your writers brain, like I had to sort of settle down into that mode and give myself that time in the beginning.

Beck: Yeah, I love that there’s flexibility with the boundary that you actually gave yourself time to explore some internet rabbit hole that you wanted to. And then there was also flexibility around how much got written.

So rather than putting that pressure on yourself that you needed to write five pages today, it was simply the act of writing something no matter what it was, in terms of length or quality. Because I’ve done something similar, I think, out of necessity, I, I try to listen to my body.

So one of the things I don’t do too well is sometimes I still push right up against a deadline. And I start the very latest time I possibly can to get that much written and end up having to write for long days, because I really have no other time.

You know, like if it’s got to be done by a certain deadline. And I don’t know how much of that is I’m motivated by pressure or how much of it is my, the rest of my schedule is just so busy that I ended up leaving the hardest thing to last and go now I’ve just got to get rid of the rest of it and get this thing done. But yeah, one of the things that I did was removed my phone from the roof. So I had this thing where I could shut down all other windows other than my word doc that I was typing on.

But I would just pick up my phone like I would pick it up religiously, like it was so automatic and unconscious that the minute I couldn’t think of what the next sentence was going to be I’d pick up my phone and five minutes would go past because I’ve checked Instagram and Facebook and then I go back and check Instagram again. Like it’s just ridiculous.

So one of the boundaries I set was to remove my phone, put it in another room, right so that it was an effort to go get it because I would just make the process so much more laborious by bringing in that distractibility. And I’m not too proud to say I am shockingly distractible as soon as the time As soon as the task is hard, you know, or the more I care about the task.

Yeah. Like, if I, if I am hanging something over my head, like this book is going to be published, it’s got to be good. Yeah. Then all of a sudden the stakes get higher. And I think I can’t possibly write something good enough to justify this particular topic. And it’s so much easier to scroll Instagram.

Ali: Absolutely, absolutely. It’s a it’s like that little kick of unpressured to like, depressurize on that on the internet, which never makes me feel better.

No, same. You know what I mean? And I still do it. And this is, again, what we’re seeing the kids, I mean, we’re seeing not just kids with everyone, just, and I still can’t figure out what it is.

It’s so goddamn addictive about it. But it’s just, you know, we’re at home a lot at the moment right now. And I just so I, as long as I don’t see my phone, yeah, then I don’t pick it up. But if I see it, I’ll pick it up and go, what is it?

So now I’m now I’m leaving books all around the house, including yours, to just go to pick up a book, like just retrain myself, because that’s what I used to do. Like, you know, I used to read more and draw more, and I go, geez, come on, you can do better than pick up the fine.

Yeah, as you know, it’s part of the business. You have to do it for business. So it’s this double edged sword of like, you’ve got to be on it to promote things because business, because that’s what they the publisher needs, you’ll have a follow up. And then you have to be on. That’s right.

Beck: Yeah. So you’ve got a community to engage with, you want the community to know who you are. And to do that you need to be on the phone, I’ve tried to set a boundary that I post, and then I check in with comments maybe once a day, and then I don’t go near-ish.

But this harder tasks I’ve got on my to do list, the more the pool is to go to the phone instead of dealing with that particular thing that’s got to be dealt with. And speaking of hard tasks, I want to talk to you about this, because thanks to my recent dm that you might have seen I got invited on to national tv live that I’ve never done before.

And the first person that I dm was you and said, Ali, how on earth do I not die on TV. So one of the things that’s happening in my career now is that there’s been some profile building thanks to the publicity around setting boundaries. And I, you know, I’m 150% an introvert.

There’s no part of me that is interested in celebrity or being out there. The only reason I do that is because I care very deeply about my work being helpful. And so to get it in front of more people that it can possibly help this is what my publisher wants me to do. Yeah. And so I kind of I think I’ve gotten old enough to just go fuck it.

I’ll do it like to stop overthinking and think just what would happen if you just said yes, rather than got all caught up in yourself and over thought it this is not actually about you, it’s about your community, so go and do it for them. And so they’re the mental games that I’ve been playing with myself, particularly over the past couple of weeks.

But I want to know from you what are your boundaries around being someone in the media because this is an entirely new world for me and I’ve noticed things like I’ll submit an article and the headline is completely changed to something that’s more provocative or something that is just a tiny bit about the article but not the actual topic. And then I have to go and dumb down my content really so that it’s in these minute kind of sound bite pieces.

Yeah, that there is there is some things that if I had full creative control over it, I I probably wouldn’t agree with and yet because it’s what the media needs. I find myself just saying yes and doing what needs to be done and then sitting back and going that headline doesn’t feel right. But I don’t have a say in that. Like Yeah, what have you learned to someone in the media and boundaries shit teach me? Yeah,

Ali: What can I teach you about it? That is and that is a very challenging place to be drawing boundaries in some ways, because even you look at the people who are doing you want to say that the top echelon of celebrity Ville who you would think would have some control over their image or over their life, you know, the, the Angelina Jolie’s or whoever, and they still have crap written about them, they still have lies written about them, in fact, probably way more than anyone else.

So there is. I remember listening to another podcast, you know, Elizabeth Gilbert. Magic. Yeah. Love her. Yeah, she’s in that. And she’s actually got a podcast called Big Magic. It was from a long time ago. I think 2016 is the last time Yeah, she

Beck: Two seasons. So she got magic lessons, I think and it was one of my favourite podcasts ever. I actually listen to all the episodes more than once. So good, right.

Ali: She talks about with, with creativity with celebrity, you know, if you call it that, and getting well known, there’s a price you pay, and you have to be aware of that there is a price that you pay. And while I don’t think there’s any, there’s like I go, never do I think it’s okay that the price you pay is that your children get drawn into it or salacious, salacious stuff is spoken about you.

You know, we, with our podcast, the press has taken sound bites out of our podcast and written horrific articles about us, and made it seem like what we were talking about in the moment happened yesterday when it happened 30 years ago. And, you know, we see those articles and cam and I thought, well, that’s it, we’re not going to do the podcast anymore.

And it’s like, No, actually, you’re not going to make us stop doing what we love to do, we do need to be more aware of exactly how much we share. But that’s also what we want to do, we do want to share our lives, our feelings, our vulnerabilities, because I think that’s really important thing to share, to relate to people.

So in that way I go, Okay, that’s the price that was somewhat paying in that in that way that they are going to take crap out. And they’re going to make up some stupid story, though those stupid stories do eventually go away.

Thank God. Yeah. Now for, for us, it’s, it’s really, um, and again, it’s sort of that same thing with Instagram, it’s like when you have something that you need to promote, like a book, or a podcast or a charity. You know, sometimes any publicity is good publicity.

And that’s when I, we find ourselves saying yes to a lot of things, because we know we can get it get the point across of what we want to sell. Though I think there are times that also, you can get a sense of like going, you know, going into an interview, we now say, this is what we’re not going to talk about.

Yeah, right. And that’s been a really good thing for us is we’re not attacking this. That’s been we’ve talked about that to death. We’re not talking about it again. You can ask for the article to be sent to you first. I need to proofread on it first. And if I don’t like it, I will change it. Yeah. So we do that now.
I mean, only when you can when they do the made-up stories. We’ve got no control. 
Beck: Yeah. I’m not. I’m certainly not at the level where people are making up stories. But I have written they had a piece that they wanted that was written in first person. And it was a piece about my wife and our relationship. And I wrote it, because I totally agree with you.

I think it’s really important to be real, and vulnerable. Because I don’t want people to look at me and go, you’ve got all your shit together, like stuff doesn’t happen to you. That’s hard. That’s bullshit. Like, on a daily basis. There’s stuff that I struggle with. And I wrote a piece about this and for a national platform.

And the headline they then used on it that I had no idea they were going to use was such that I then didn’t want to share it and I haven’t actually haven’t shared it with my community because the headline was so provocative and yeah, I I feel like such a small fish in the pond that I can’t speak up about that and say that’s not okay.

Because it felt clickbaity to me, you know, like, yeah, yeah, and they wanted it to be to be like that, because it helps obviously, their platform and I don’t feel like I’m in a place where I can dictate, this is what it must be.

I mean, obviously I write the piece so the actual content of the pieces within my control But it’s not in my control in terms of what they make it mean. And as, as I put myself out there more I find myself wanting to shrink and stay quiet and not talk about things that are potentially vulnerable.

And yet that doesn’t feel authentic. And so I wanted to talk to you about your experiences, because you’re so much more in the public eye than I am. And I just really admire your courage in being able to confront this because obviously, you and Cam have been in the public eye since you were both very young there. This is not new for you. Yeah. But I was out of it for 25 years. Yeah. So this it’s right. I didn’t forget.

The minute you showed up on my Instagram page, I was I ran to this I was like, oh, T and she’s like, this is too young. Yeah. There’s a there’s a window of women that remember me. God, I love those women. Any 25 year old to like?

Ali: Yeah, it’s um, gosh, it’s such a funny one, isn’t it? It’s just I don’t know. It’s it’s just something that is the thing that I find that helps that helped me. And I and I know you will understand this is that unless I have really worked through what it is, I want to share my my vulnerability about this.

Then I won’t share it. There’s things that cam and I are still working on in our relationship that I will not put on the podcast. Yeah. Because I’m not. I’m not okay. I haven’t gotten an understanding for it for myself. And I don’t want to put out there and for it to be dissected.

Beck: Yes. So and then your emotional position on a be rocked?

Ali: Yes. And I’m careful always with the kids. Like I always say when we talk about Can I talk about this with you and my, my eldest daughter, who’s just gorgeous human being. I was writing a few articles for kidspot and stuff. And I wrote one. I wrote this one, I wanted to write this one particular article about her. And I went to her and I said, Would you How would you feel if I wrote this? And she said, I’m not okay with it. Okay, that was it. That was that will never be written about. And I was really glad that she said that.

Beck: Yeah, that’s indicative that she has a level of emotional safety with us that she can set a boundary back, which is amazing.

Ali: Yeah. So I’ve, yeah, and people have, you know, our son is gay. And there’s been a couple of times people have come to us going, Oh, can you share about that with your son? And it’s like, actually, no. No, because, again, that my kids, if I can protect them from quit clickbait, you know, then that is the best thing I can possibly do. I can’t always protect us.

You know, so that was something that we were really protective around. Yeah, he’s fine. He’s like, Elon, whatever you want to do. But just the way society is, you know, I didn’t want anyone saying making some stupid comment, or, you know, I just didn’t want that.

Beck: So using him as a piece of content. I Exactly. I feel very strongly about that with Bennett is he’s not a piece of content. I mean, you’ll never see his foot. I’ve never shed his face on social media because he’s not a piece of content. For me. He’s been he has his he can’t consent. And so that, that just doesn’t happen for me.

But it’s a bomb for me to hear you say that there’s this struggle between what’s required to sell a particular book or product or to get a course out there in the public eye. versus being able to have your boundaries intact and keep yourself to yourself.

Yeah, because I I feel like your understanding of that is kind of what I’m a baby and experiencing right now, which is how much am I okay with giving or in a public eye setting. Because I want this book in more people’s hands. I’m trying to do it in a values-driven way.

That keeps me grounded. That isn’t doesn’t just get me to a point where I’m trying to To sell books, therefore I’ll do or say anything. I’ll talk about anything. Yeah. And obviously, we’re talking about a very few number of experiences compared to yours and Cams.

But I want to, I almost want to do is as my coach at the very beginning, because of this one experience has happened just in the last week, actually, just in the last couple of days where I saw that headline, and I was like, I need to talk to ollie about this because that feels yuck to me. And it’s the first time that that has happened.

Because normally I have full control, I post on my no one else controls my instant, my social media accounts except for me. So I write what I’m okay with writing, I show what I’m okay with showing. And that was the first time someone’s taking control of a piece of my content, and put something on it that I thought, Oh, come on, like. Do we need to make it that? And yet here I am, fully.

I need to be fully transparent. I need to sell books. That’s, that’s my job. My job for my publisher. Yeah, because of their investment in me is to make sure that these books sell and so and then what your community wants once, that’s what you want to assist with, with Yeah, it’s a why you’re a helper. So that’s a weird duality, though, isn’t it? Yeah,

Ali: It’s just weird. Yeah. Yeah. And again, I just, and I think that there’s also, you know, because I go, keep drawing, keep, you know, when you keep drawing the boundaries have no, you cannot print this piece unless I get full control. And that includes the heading. Yeah.

Could you have said that? And would they have approved that? I hope so. Yeah. You know. And but yeah, before it goes to press I want for, for writing, that’s a yes. For me. And you can do that, you know, and I think about though, and this shouldn’t even be a thought. It’s like, if a man was doing that, would they have more freedom in that rather than a woman doing that? Or does she just get deemed where she’s difficult?

Beck: I was just about to say, it’s interesting, because what’s showing up for me, as you say that, you know, in terms of insisting that you see the headline and everything, it what’s showing up for me is but I don’t want to be difficult to work with.

I don’t want them not to come back to me and ask for another article because they like our she’s just hard work. And yet. That’s bullshit. Yeah, yeah. Hard work.

Yeah, it’s the again, it’s that the scales of like, okay, where am I going to draw it? How do I feel drawing that boundary? Is it going to stick it? Am I going to be okay with it? Yeah, give a little bit here. Or, you know, throw some other headlines at me. This isn’t quite Yeah.

Oh, I like that. As someone who just wrote an entire book on boundaries, let me be honest, I still have trouble setting boundaries. Sometimes. I still have problems with medavoy. Ali, I love you so much.

Thank you for talking about this with me today. And for you always create such a safe space. I one of the things I love most about you is that I would feel comfortable coming to you for any topic that makes me feel most shaky in the world.

And thank you that that just really I think speaks to your heart and to what you’re doing in the world in terms of opening up with separate bathrooms and with your new book, menopause. And we don’t know the title of it, new book on menopause. And I just, I just want to thank you for being you and for being that person for me.

Ali: Oh, well, look, I mean, the feeling is absolutely mutual. And, you know, when you when you responded to my comment on your page, I’d already been following you and saving all your quotes.

Beck: And, you know, just going this woman is amazing. I just think it’s fascinating. And again, you know about Instagram and social media, you do get a feel for who people are when they’re honest about who they are on Instagram and you were just someone that was very clear to me was just so divine and it’s amazing how our friendship has developed over you know, being in a different state and being on social media.

Ali: Yeah, it’s like that’s when I go see Instagrams pointed at is really like this is listeners, you should know this is actually the only the third time in our lives that we’ve spoken in real time. So Allie and I have had coffee face to face. You’ve spoken on the phone once, I think, and this is the third time in our lives in our four year friendship,

Beck:  I think that we’ve actually spoken in real time. And yet I’m in terms of friends like you’re right up there for me. It’s social media can be used for good people like it can be used for. Absolutely. It can bring you really amazing things. If you want to find out more about la please go follow her at @AliDaddo.

Ali: That’s on the app. Yeah, Apple iPhone. Yeah, things. Or you can Google that we have a Separate Bathrooms Facebook page as well. But yeah, and handles all that I’m terrible on Facebook.

Beck: We both outsource things to our respective spouses for things like that, who are actually our respective spouses collaborate musically, quite often.

So my wife Nyssa Ray and Ali’s husband, Cameron Daddo. Are quite remarkable musicians and they collaborate.

So this is the other collaboration that’s come from our friendship is that would never have happened if we didn’t have mutual love over Instagram. So true. Yes. Thank you for being with me.
For those of you that want to find out more about Ellie’s work on menopause, please make sure that you stick around to our pages, because you can bet that I’m certainly not going to be quiet when that book comes out in March. So I’ll be promoting it but make sure that you follow Allie so that you know exactly when it’s coming out as well.

Lovely ones if you have gotten something out of this episode, I’m so happy to hear that and I’m so grateful for you listening. Thank you for being part of my community and thank you for being with us today. If you’d like to explore more, my latest book setting boundaries has just been released. I’m very excited and also very nervous that it’s now out in the world. If you want to get your hands on it, you can do so at rebeccaray.com.au/books and I will catch you very shortly for the next episode of Hello Rebecca Ray soon