Show Notes:

Welcome to Hello Rebecca Ray, our collective home for courage, growth, and human to human connection. I’m your host, Dr. Rebecca Ray, human, clinical psychologist, author, and educator. I know only too well how fear, comparison, and self-doubt can stifle your potential. This podcast is all about brave and meaningful living, and how you can make your authentic contribution to the world today and everyday.

Rebecca Ray: Lovely ones, welcome to Hello Rebecca Ray the podcast I am super excited to have Chloe McLeod with me today. Chloe is an expert in nutrition for optimising your health and well being. She has more than 12 years experience as a dietitian, and her expertise in gut health, food intolerance and sports nutrition makes her one of the most sought after nutrition experts in Australia. Chloe is the founder and director of Verde Nutrition Co, the head of nutrition at the Parramatta Eels, part of Vida. Vida Glow skin professional panel and regularly consults to corporate and food industry. Chloe, I must admit I’m slightly intimidated to have you here today.

Chloe McLeod: I was gonna say I didn’t know you were going to say all of that at the start of the podcast now I’m like oh, gosh I’m been embarrassed.

Rebecca Ray: No, no, don’t let’s celebrate expertise that we have along. I’m intimidated, because I would say that nutrition in terms of my own habits is the habit I’m least confident with. It’s the habit, that’s the first to go whenever I get stressed. It’s the habit that I feel overwhelmed the most by. And it’s the habit that I feel confronted by on a daily basis. So I’m feeling this duality and listeners will know I talk about duality all the time. My emotional duality right now is I just feel so incredibly grateful to have access to you to be able to dive into your brain for this podcast, but also slightly intimidated, because we’re going to talk about things that I find overwhelming. But I also think that they’re essential to talk about because we can’t avoid it, like can’t just not eat.

Chloe McLeod: But also, I think that I appreciate your honesty with feeling a little bit intimidated. But you’re certainly not alone. And I think you know, the things that you just mentioned of your nutrition habits being the first ones to go when things get stressed and finding it all a little bit overwhelming, that’s what I see every single day when I see clients. So it’s a really, I don’t want to say normal, but it’s a really common thing for people to experience. And I’m really excited to talk to you about how we can make small little changes and how with some of the other things that that you’re doing, the other areas of changes that you’re making, you can make small nutrition changes, which makes it really positive and significant differences as well. So it’s not just having to need to overhaul your entire diet and go on a massive challenge and cut everything out. And you know, you can still enjoy your your orange buttons and whatever else it might be. It’s about how can you find the balance that’s going to work for you and your life rather than being perfect? Because we don’t ask ourselves to be perfect in any other area of our life. I always find it really interesting that we have almost have this expectation that nutrition needs to be perfect. It’s like, well, why? It doesn’t. And what is perfect as well?

Rebecca Ray: Yeah, I’m so glad that you say that. Because as someone who is not perfectionistic in other areas of my life, I used to be when I was younger, but age is a really helpful thing age and our time, and how our time gets compressed when we have little ones. I don’t have time to be perfectionistic anywhere else. But yeah, I find it still does show up. If we’re talking about nutrition I have, my brain will still launch into but if it’s not a massive change, then it doesn’t count, so to speak. So I’m excited to dive into that with you especially because you know, my latest book, Small Habits For A Big Life is all about the consistency, tiny things that we can do consistently that make a big difference for the long term. And surprisingly, I’ve had a lot of readers contact me and say, well, this helped me lose weight, or will this help me with my health habits? And I’m always a little bit stuck because the book is so much about mindset, but it’s not about any one particular element of your life. So I wanted to bring you on to help answer those readers questions if they do want to make specific health changes. But the first thing I’m curious about is, how did you arrive here in the first place? What is it about nutrition that drew you in? And what has your career looked like so far?

Chloe McLeod: Well, so since I was a little kid, I’ve had eczema. And as a result of that, I’ve always had to be aware of what I was eating. Because we worked out pretty early on, I say, we, my mom and I worked out pretty early on that food played a big role in my eczema. Yeah, so there’s these days, it is a bit more environmental, rather than food related. But the food is something that I need to be across. And fortunately, I’m at a space now where, you know, if we went out for dinner, you’d have no idea that I had to worry about it, because I can just manage it. And I know what’s going on. But that’s what made me interested in the first place. And then, you know, sort of fast forward through to Year 12, when I was trying to work out what I wanted to do at uni. And you know, there was everything from being like, I’d like to be a diplomat to maybe I won’t go to uni, maybe I’ll be a hairdresser, which really glad that didn’t happen, because I’m awful with my own hair let alone anyone else’s hair. So, you know, I had all these different ideas of things that I might want to do, and I, again, chatting with my mom, and she’s like, “well, you enjoy helping people, you like talking to people, and you like food. So maybe maybe you could look at doing nutrition”. That’s a good idea. And then I started studying health science. I’m not sure what the, the ATAR or the TR or whatever it’s called now is now but at that point in time, it was 98, or 99, out of 100. And I didn’t get that. Because you know, that’s quite high. I started in health science, and then I transferred into nutrition and dietetics and finished that degree in Adelaide. Since then, I moved from Adelaide, where I studied to northeast Victoria to Melbourne up to Sydney, and I was in Sydney for 10 years and then have recently moved back to South Australia again. So I’m enjoying being a little bit closer to the family again. And through that time, I’ve been really, really fortunate to work in a variety of different areas of nutrition from Community Health, working directly in GP practices, university lecturing, to working in my own practice. So since 2016, I’ve been working for myself and have had a couple of other businesses along the way. But I started Verde nutrition in July of this year. And the key purpose of Verde is to help individuals wherever they live. And so you know, if you whether you live in central Sydney, and you can’t get access, or we can’t leave the office easily. So you need to see a dietitian, or if you might live remotely, you know, in the middle of New South Wales or middle of WA or something like that, and are needing an expert to help you with your nutrition concerns. So it doesn’t matter where you live, it means that you can access the expert you need. And I’m really fortunate, I’ve got a really great team of dietitians who I work with who are experts in their own areas. So I have a fertility expert, an eating disorders expert, diabetes expert, and, and so on and so forth. So the team is growing. And it’s a lot of work, but it’s a lot of fun. So as well as the other bits and pieces that you mentioned at the start of the podcast that I get to do as well.

Rebecca Ray: All the media stuff that you’re doing, and also the corporate stuff that you’re doing and your consulting work as well.

Chloe McLeod: Yeah, well, and I think it all feeds into each other. So you know that, to me, the reason for doing media work is you know, to help with raising my own profile, which then helps with raising my businesses profile, which then helps my team. So it’s about how can I leverage more people knowing about what I do, which will then help the business to grow in which then benefits the team. And the corporate work, it’s not just myself who do that, and certain members of the team do that as well. And yeah, it’s just nice to have a bit of a mix in there as well. So learning different things and you know over time, there’s been times when I’ve done a lot more private practice myself, times when I’ve done very little and focused more on sports. Times where it’s been completely different to both of those. So yeah, it’s, it’s been a bit of a journey, but it’s it’s been a pretty fun one overall.

Rebecca Ray: I love the variety. Can I ask what might be a stupid question, is there a difference between a nutritionist and a dietitian?

Chloe McLeod: There is and there’s no such thing as a stupid question. So you can certainly ask, it can just mean a difference in level of education, but it may not. So it’s just worthwhile if you’re seeing a nutritionist to check what they’ve done for their education, so dietician has to have done an accredited course through a university, which has been accredited through the Dieticians Association. A nutritionist may have done nearly the same course and other than the placement or a very similar course. However, a nutritionist may have also done like a two week online course. That’s, you know, from some random thing that they got off some random thing.

Rebecca Ray: Some rando, it’s like, it sounds like it’s a difference between a psychologist and a counsellor as well, there are, there are such things as counselling psychologists, so they might have gone and done psychology and studied and become registered and that involves quite a lot of study in many years. And yet any random person off the street can call themselves a counsellor and just start up a practice.

Chloe McLeod: Yeah, exactly. So and it doesn’t mean that counsellors or nutritionists don’t have a really good level of education. It’s just you just need to do a little bit more homework on them to make sure that the one who you’re wanting to see does. Yeah, so it’s really interesting. I feel like there’s in in some circles, there’s a bit of friction between dieticians and nutritionists. But I’m just saying, just make sure that if you’re going to be a professional, be a professionaland get a decent level of education, rather than going by your own personal experience being a level of education. But also, if you’re going to work with a health professional, make sure that the person you’re seeing has the credentials that they need in order to be able to truly help you as well. So you know, there’s just like, I’m sure there’s some really excellent people out there who really have a level of education that makes them be a counsellor, but not a psychologist. It’s the same. There’s some really wonderful nutritionists out there who aren’t dietitians. And there’s nothing wrong with that. They’ve done the university level qualifications, they’ve got the experience in the bank.

Rebecca Ray: So for listeners, just be just make sure you do your homework before you sign up to see someone so that you know what it is that they’re offering you. So can we talk about small habits, I’m really interested in the mistakes that you see people make with their nutrition. For one of the things that I’ve noticed with habits, full stop, whether they be health habits, or whether they be productivity habits, or life habits, is that sometimes habits can be insidious. So we can go from a period in life where we actually have really healthy habits, habits that are aligned with who we want to be. And then they can slip through our fingers in a really insidious way, to the point where all of a sudden, it’s like a couple of years later, and you wake up one day and realise that many of your old healthy habits have now disappeared and been replaced by habits that are not supporting you should be who you want to be. So I’m wondering, what are the mistakes that you see commonly that people are making with their nutritional habits on a daily basis?

Chloe McLeod: Yeah, so the there’s a few big ones shall I say. So probably the two biggest would be, number one, expecting to make all of the changes all at once, and then sustain all of those changes all at once forever. Which if we look at habit change, we know that that’s a really, really difficult thing to do sustainably, it’s pretty easy to make a whole heap of large changes, short term, get some change happening, to retain those changes is really difficult. So that that’s a big place I see people become unstuck. And secondly is and it’s sort of in line with that first one is, people actually under eating and then as a result over eating, and particularly if we’re looking at weight management, this is something I see. So it might be that you know, I need to lose weight, I need to eat less. I need to eat less. So you know, hardly anything for breakfast. I’ve skipped my morning snack, I’ll just have a salad like literally just the salad, no protein, no carbs, no healthy fats at lunch, and then wonder why I’m so ravenous by three o’clock and then eat for the entire of the rest of the day. So it ends up being that that seesaw isn’t nice and balanced. It means that the seesaw is just going like this across all across the day and then as a result of poor nutrition choices are made. And also, despite trying to under, like, have that calorie deficit ending up over eating because you’ve ended up so hungry because you didn’t eat enough earlier on in the day.

Rebecca Ray: So if that happens, random question, is this a thing? If someone is not eating in a balanced way throughout the day, so the caloric intake is perhaps compressed to the later hours in the day, is it a thing then that they would crave certain foods by that time because they have gotten so hungry? So you said poorer nutrition choices by then, is that because we’re looking for convenience foods? Or is it because we’re actually craving a certain type of food because we’re over hungry?

Chloe McLeod: A little bit of both. So I think when you get that hungry, it’s like, I can’t wait any longer. I need to have whatever it might be. And, you know, we often talk about that three o’clock chocolate craving. And so if you’ve not eaten us, by that middle of the afternoon, time of day, often what we’re craving is some carbohydrate. And we’re craving it because carbohydrate, you know, regardless of what sort of diet people talk about being on or not, carbohydrate is the main source of fuel that your body uses through the course of the day, particularly your brain, it’s the main source of fuel that your brain uses. So if you’re sitting and working all day, and you’ve not consumed enough light, in general, chances are come that three o’clock, you’re going to be starting to get quite hungry, going to be craving carbohydrates, and your brain tells you that you need something sort of quick and usually in that sort of timeframe is when you’d like maybe some chocolate or you know, whether it’s whether it’s sweet or savoury that you go for, but it’s usually something that’s that more convenient, it’s quick, it’s gonna give you that boost in energy a little bit more quickly than having like a, you know, something that’s more whole grain and low GI and so on and so forth. So, and that’s where things can often go a bit unstuck for people, and then you know, sometimes there’ll be that inner self talk that’s happening, of like, Have I failed, I’ve screwed everything up, today’s a write off, I’ll just go and do x. So that, again, it’s it’s not a mistake, it’s just human psychology and how humans work is that, you know, if things don’t quite go right, then often, it’s quite easy to go down the garden path of things not going right. And then as a result of that, then maybe instead of having the lovely healthy dinner that you had planned on preparing, that’s when maybe that internal dialogue goes off, or today’s written off anyway, so I’m just gonna go and get x y z instead. And, and I think this is where we can look at small changes, to bring it back to the initial question. And I want to talk about how we can avoid this happening in the first place. But if this does happen, because you know, you’re human, fair, everybody tuning in, you’re human, and it’s not about being perfect. And whether you’ve intentionally tried to have a bit less, or maybe, you know, it got to three o’clock in the afternoon, and you realised or you dating with a few spoons of your breakfast, because then you’re running around after kids and, you know, life happened. You know, sometimes these things can happen and completely unintentionally. So it’s about going, okay, well, things haven’t gone to plan today, but what can I do to make it easy for me to get back on track again? And what can I do to make it easy for me to make that healthier choice more frequently. So I think, to think about habits and consistency and nutrition, to me, they like the perfect pair, you know, they you can’t have a healthy body, in my opinion, unless you are consistent with your neutral attritional habits. So you’re not gonna be healthy because you ate a salad for lunch once. Because, you know, you drank a cup, one cup of water in the day

Rebecca Ray: On this one day about three months ago and

Chloe McLeod: You know, that’s not going to make you healthy. It’s about being consistent every single day. And weaving into that some of those things that we might consider less healthy of how however that might well look for you so that you can feel to be your healthiest self. So one of the things I I really dislike seeing on Instagram is the like my perfect day on a plate like it makes me want to like facepalm every single time I see them, you know, if that’s helpful for people, that’s great, but in my opinion, there’s there’s no perfect day that is the perfect day for everybody. It’s like there’s going to be similarities of cause but it’s about looking at what’s going to work for you as an individual. And I know you brought up before we hopped on recording about meal prepping, and that sort of thing. Yeah, I’m a big fan of meal prepping, if that helps you. But if that doesn’t help you, if that causes you anxiety, because you’re like I don’t have it all arranged in a perfectly glasses container

Rebecca Ray: That would fit the home edit, so that my fridge is in rainbow order.

Chloe McLeod: Like, just take the pressure off, right? Like, you know, it’s lovely to have a well organised pantry and lovely to have a well organised fridge, of course. But also, actually just having the healthy stuff there is more important than it being in a perfect job or in a perfect organisation or thing. So I think that the number one thing I’d say is take the pressure off yourself, and that those small changes at a time that you can build on are really important.

Rebecca Ray: Where would you be getting people to start then with this small changes? If they’re listening to this and nodding along going I actually do all of that, and, not the pretty fridge, not that you know, but that they’re listening because the scenario that you’ve described is them. Let’s say they come and see you for a consult. And they’re like, I just, um, so out of whack, what do I do first?

Chloe McLeod: Yeah, so this might be different for everyone. So I feel like it’s actually a little bit of a difficult thing to answer. But if I look at the things that I would most commonly say, it’s really, it’s about looking at the path of least resistance. So what is going to be the easiest thing for you to change. So as an example, maybe it might be starting to have a glass of water, about 10 or 15 minutes before every single meal. And the reason for this is, most people don’t drink enough water across the course of the day. So by having that glass of water before the meal, that will then help with being more hydrated through the course of the day as a number one. The other thing it does though, is it helps you to manage how much you’re eating throughout the day, too. So what I mean here is sometimes when you are a bit dehydrated, you can actually think that you’re a little bit hungry, because your brain gets a bit confused. Often, you’ll then also be craving carbs in those times too. So by having those glasses of water, it’s helping you be hydrated, which will also help with managing your appetite and your portion sizes of food through the day, because you’re not going on a bit peckish, when actually Oh, you’re actually a little bit hungry. So that 10 to 15 minutes before it’s a really helpful one. So starting there, the next one that I’d say talk to people about most commonly is looking at how their plate is set up. So aiming for at least two of the main meals, if not three, but at least two of the main meals in the day to be half of it, the colour. So when I talk about colour, I’m talking predominantly about vegetables and salad. So aiming to include few you make sort of a cup with your hands, I know you can see on the screen. But for those tuning in, make a micro little cup with both of your hands. If your hands are full of veggies or salad, that’s what we want on your plate. And then keeping using our hands because you know, we’ve always got them with us. And these are approximates as well. So for some people might be slightly different to this, but in general, that half a cup of salad. So that two cup hands, a quarter, a quarter of the plate each of your protein and your carbohydrate. So if you can imagine that’s about the size of your fist, or about the size of your palm. And then also including around the size of your thumb, so that a tablespoon of healthy fat. So that might be some avocados and extra virgin olive oils and nuts and seeds. So aiming as often as possible to set your plate up like that. So the small change might be instead of having just a bowl of pasta and sauce for dinner, it’s having a pasta and sauce, but then having a side salad. Or it might be instead of just having some meat and mashed potato, it might be having made mashed potato with some stuff like fried greens. Or it might be instead of having your stir fry which is like you’ve got some veggies in there, and you’ve got some some made or some tofu and some noodles, bulking it out with some extra veggies. So the it’s not about changing the entirety of what you’re eating. In most instances. It’s about going okay, well how can we adjust the portions of what you’re having to better match it and up the intake of those plant foods and this feeds into something which which I know we’ve spoken about briefly as well as the 30 plants across the course of the week. There’s some really excellent research around the variety of plants and the really positive impact that that has on your digestive health where you’ve got health and then the impact that having a healthy gut has on the rest of your body and A lot of the time I like to talk about the role it has on your mental health. I know many people are struggling. And I’m not suggesting eating 30 plants is going to fix your mental health issues, by the way, but it can help support them by making better food choices, and eating that variety of plants, it has been shown in really great good quality, randomised controlled trials, that it can directly have a positive impact on depressive and anxiety symptoms. So it’s really worthwhile starting to make those changes. So again, looking at small changes, you might say, Okay, well, instead of buying just the cashews, I’m going to buy them mixed nuts. So I’ve got a variety of nuts. And instead of buying the frozen blueberries, I’m going to buy the frozen mixed berries. And when I buy a bag of salad, instead of buying baby spinach only, I’m going to buy the five leaf salad mix, and so on and so forth. So those are some really easy ways of making change, small changes, which you basically won’t notice, they’re changes that you make when you’re at the shop. So it’s what you’ve then got home. And then suddenly, instead of having three clients, so like a blueberry, cashew and baby spinach, well hopefully you’re having more than a blueberry, but you know what I mean.

Instead, you’re having, you know, probably close to 15 plants, because of the variety of things you’re getting there. So it’s a massive, massive change, with only a very small change. So I think looking at some of those things, and then if we’re looking, I know, we sort of mentioned that there’s people who have reached out to you who are wanting to look at weight loss, some of the little mini changes that you might be able to make that can have a really positive impact on us. If you’re somebody who drinks soft drinks, as an example, swapping out one soft drink per day for a sparkling water or a soda water. That’s not suggesting you can’t have the soft drink. But just instead of having one of the soft drinks, you might have been having have that one instead. Or if you’re somebody who finds that you are relying on takeaway food a lot of the time, instead of getting like the large meal with the soft drink and the large chips, maybe get the meal with the small chips and a water instead. And the caloric difference that you’re getting from that meal, you still having the meal. And of course, you know, we’re not here to talk about never having blah, blah, blah, it’s you know, if you really want to have a habit, but make a small change, and then suddenly, it’s, you’re still getting the probably the part of the meal that you’re looking forward to the most. But with a much lower impact on how much you’re going to be eating, particularly of processed sugar and highly saturated fats that across the day. And if you’re consistently doing that, if you do that, over weeks and months and years, the positive impact that’s going to have on your health over time. And talking about small habits, it’s huge. So it’s to come back to what we’re talking about at the start. It’s not about making big changes all at once. It’s the small, incremental things that we can do at a time. And, and I think on all of this, it’s about looking at what you’re ready to change. And you know, I said there was a few things which I said the biggest mistakes that probably the third one would be people telling themselves they need to make all these changes, but not actually wanting to make the change. You know, if you are like, Chloe, I don’t want to give up on my, you know, every single night having half a bottle of wine as an example, that’s probably something I say pretty frequently. It’s okay, let’s not work on that first. Let’s look at other changes we can make in your diet first, before we start looking at that, and then when you’re ready to look at that, we can look at it. Because I think alcohol probably alcohol and coffee are the two biggest things that people are like, I can’t give it up. So you shouldn’t have to give it up. It’s just about how can you incorporate into your life in a healthy manner, so that it’s not having a negative impact on the goals that you want to achieve. And in my experience, working with people on things that they’re ready to change that so much more successful, because they actually want to change it. And then that gives them the motivation and encouragement to go on here. I’m going to try having a couple of nights a week where I don’t have that wine. Instead of having the half a bottle that I share with my husband, I’m gonna just have the one glass and see how that goes. And again, small changes over time and incrementally. These incremental small changes work out to be really big changes. And because they’re small, they make bigger changes to your life across the longer term rather than a big change in the short term. So it’s about long term thinking versus that shorter term thinking sometimes I think.

Rebecca Ray: I love how reasonable all of this is. I just wanna swing back to, you mentioned Instagram before. And one of the things that I see on Instagram and perhaps psychologically influenced by every now and again, is this demonization of carbohydrates. And everything you’ve said here does not demonise carbohydrates. So can we please just talk very briefly about why carbs potentially aren’t bad because I see lots of things that say they are bad and they need to be removed or at least lessened dramatically for weight loss. And what you’re saying is quite the opposite of that.

Chloe McLeod: Yeah, it is and it’s one of the things I find the most disappointing about social media is the the misinformation, whether it’s carbs or certain other things, but carbs, definitely get the get the blame a lot of the time. So when it comes to carbs, it’s, it’s about what carbohydrate are we looking at. So soft drink, processed fruit juices, like sweets chop, like any chocolates, etc, etc. They’re not healthy carbohydrates. Like I think we’d all agree that there, whilst they might be yummy, they’re not very good for us from, like, I knew if I look nutritionally specifically, psychologically, there may well be, but that’s pushed to the side for a moment. So those sorts of carbohydrates, if you would choose to include them, it’s have them sometimes in small amounts, and enjoy them when you have them. But they’re not your key source of carbohydrates. So those ones, it’s, I don’t like saying the less you have the better. But if we’re looking at a truly nutritionally, like we’re only not looking at any anything else, the less you have of those things develop from purely nutritional standpoint. There’s always a caveat to it, of course, but in general, the types of carbohydrates that I’m talking about are the less processed carbohydrates. So foods which still have some really great nutritional value to them. So they, you know, they break down slowly, there’s a variety of micronutrients that they contain that your body is going to be able to use beneficially. And also, the these carbohydrates also tend to be quite rich in fibre as well, which is particularly important for our gastrointestinal tract. Particularly important if it’s resistant starch, or prebiotic fibre. So these types of fibres feed the healthy bacteria in our gut, which then help to produce compounds called short chain fatty acids. They’re short chain fatty acids, they are my opinion, the real superheroes when it comes to anything, so they are particularly anti inflammatory, and have been shown to directly reduce the risk of certain health issues such as bowel cancer, heart disease, diabetes, so forth because of the particularly important role that they play. So cutting out all of these fibre rich, minimally processed carbohydrates is actually one of the worst things you can do for your health long term. And, unfortunately, so these foods include things like quinoa and barley, and whole grain breads, and sourdough and pasta, chickpeas, lentils, black beans, because of all the prebiotic starch that these things contain. And because of what’s going on in your gut to create these short chain fatty acids, fermentation is occurring. That’s why that’s part of that digestive process. If you never eat these things, then you’re more likely to get a bit of digestive discomfort, particularly with legumes, it’s you know, the old baked beans make you fart situation it’s true. That’s like that’s literally what they do. But the more frequently you eat them, the better your gut gets at digesting them. And the less over fermentation of gas production is happening, the better your body is able to manage all of that so you don’t get that discomfort. So people who regularly eat those foods don’t seem to get as much or if any issues as people who never eat them. And that’s part of where the demonization has come from as well. It’s like, oh, I don’t feel very good when I eat chickpeas is a common one. It’s not about the chickpea. Actually, it’s the fact that it’s the type of fibre that your body is not used to digesting so.

Rebecca Ray: So there’s reactivity there that wouldn’t be there if your body was used to it?

Chloe McLeod: Exactly. But then suddenly adding heaps back into your diet isn’t going to help because it’s just going to leave you uncomfortable. So it’s about reintroducing it but taking it really slow, so I will have some time to talk to my clients about, I just want you to have three chickpeas in your meal, let’s just add them back in. So they’re there. But there’s not enough there that it’s actually going to cause a problem. And we can do that with any prebiotic rich food as well, or fibre rich fruit in general, really. So introducing small amounts back in at a time to help your body to manage it more effectively. And over time, so I’m talking six months or more, it’s a long, slow process. But it’s really worthwhile one. And this again, comes back to small changes, because if you did this all at once, it wouldn’t work. So small changes at a time, add it back in. Little bit, little bit little bit, and it’s going to help foster better health in the long term.

Rebecca Ray: Wow, this was so incredibly valuable. I’ve got one final question. Let’s say there are listeners who are sitting here listening and have tried a million different diets have tried a million different, I guess, ways of approaching their health and then nutrition, and constantly feel like they’re falling off the waggon. And starting again, and perhaps feeling ashamed and hopeless around whether or not they’ll ever be able to make a change, or whether they’re too far gone. What’s the thing that you would like them to hear before we finish up?

Chloe McLeod: You are 100% not too far gone, there’s there’s never going to be a right time to start. Our health is always a work in progress. And there’s different seasons to life that make it easier and harder to be on top of your health as well. Like to use myself as an example, I have been exercising way less than I like to recently for a number of different reasons, both from a health perspective, as well as a life perspective, I have two little kids who are under three, like it’s life is just mental. So it’s, you know, if I’m not here to answer this talking about myself, but I’ve had to accept that in this season of my life, just with how things are at the moment. That’s how it is. And I know it will change. So ensuring that I’m doing what I can when I can so that the habit doesn’t completely disappear. By the time I can, again, is what I’ve personally been trying to do. So for those tuning in, it’s about going well, just because things aren’t perfect at the moment, or just because things haven’t been so easy for me previously doesn’t mean that my life isn’t going to change to make it a bit easier. But what can I do right now, that is a small change that will help me on my way. So it could be something as small as having that extra glass of water, swapping it and having that instead of having that soft drink, or it might be swapping and having a slightly like that five leaf mix rather than having a one type of salad on the plate. Or it might be going you know what I’m going to make sure I’ve always got some fruits and veggies in my freezer, so that I can make sure that my dinner is always at least half vegetables, so that I’m hitting my daily vegetable intake. So it’s not about being perfect. It’s about making, it’s about doing what you can in the moment. And knowing that, you know, your health is is a continual journey. And I read something a while ago about to go off on a slight tangent. I know we need to finish up but I’ve read something about cigarette smoking and how when you smoke cigarettes, if you say there was something about if you stopped by a certain age, then by the time you got to that certain another certain age, your body would be able to completely recover because of the cell regeneration and turnover and things that happens. I can’t remember the exact numbers. Yeah, it’s not relevant anyway. But um, like if your body can recover from smoking cigarettes for however many years, your body can recover from probably really anything. So as long as you are consistent in the changes that you make, and you know, it’s not about being perfect every day. It’s not about going you know what, I screwed it up. It’s like, I’m human. I’m gonna go on, you know, there’s going to be times when I might conscience consciously make a less healthy choice, because that’s what I feel like doing in the moment. That’s cool, do it. But then just get back into making those healthy choices as consistently as you can and over time, you’ll see the benefit.

Rebecca Ray: Amazing. Thank you so much, Chloe, can you please tell listeners where they can find more of you?

Chloe McLeod: For sure. And thanks so much for having me. You can find me on Instagram I’m Chloe_McLeod_dietitian. Otherwise, I’m on LinkedIn @Chloe McLeod Dietitian. My business website is Verde Nutrition Co is that stuff and my own website is chloemcleodcom. Yeah, find me any of those places.

Rebecca Ray: You’re amazing. Thank you so much for being here today in providing us with so much value.

Chloe McLeod: Oh, thank you so much for having me. It’s been so, so wonderful to chat to you.



Lovely ones, thank you so much for listening to Hello, Rebecca Ray. If you got something meaningful from this episode, and the most meaningful thing you can do is jump on over to wherever you listen to your podcast episodes and leave a review. Because it’s those reviews that help this podcast stay here. Make sure to subscribe, and if you’re generous enough to share this episode, thank you so much. I love seeing your shares on social media. So please tag me, catch you next time.