Show Notes:

Hi, lovely ones. Welcome to episode number 39. Today, I’m sharing with you an episode that features a conversation I had with someone I love dearly, and incredible woman by the name of Mish Pope. Mish is a life coach and she had a podcast called In Her Own Way.

She’s currently pivoting and redesigning her life as we speak. So that podcast is no longer up. But I’m lucky enough to have the audio of this phenomenal conversation that I had with her on all things courage, worthiness and hope. And I want to share with you the space that we created together. Mish is such a brilliant question asker and large this conversation so much, and I hope that you enjoy it too.

Mish: Okay, so I am here with pretty much my most favourite people that I’ve actually never met in the flesh. Dr. Rebecca Ray, I pretty much talk to you until I got on the podcast last year to talk about your first book be happy. And then I saw the have another book out about bravery. And I can’t wait until I get it in my little hot hands, which will probably take 10,000 years because I live in a regional area. But I digress. Um, why do I adore you?

Mish:  I adore you because you are giving something to the internet, which it desperately needs, which is authenticity and courage and conversation and vulnerability and permission. And you keep it simple. You know, sometimes you like read these posts and like, what just what do they just say, you know, like, it’s too long. It’s too winded. It’s too.

Mish: Like, just you know what I mean? Like, it’s just too much. And I feel like what you’re Yeah, was me something really simple. So I won’t go on anymore about how much I adore you. So tell us about yourself. Yeah, and then let’s just dive into this conversation on brave.

Rebecca: I’m sure. Well, first of all, you’re the first person that has ever cried in a podcast that I did. So I kind of adore you too for that. Because I’m all the  feelings. And when I get into podcast mode, I sometimes have to remember that I don’t have put on my psychologist voice and, you know, be all professional.

Rebecca: And that conversation I remember for being just so real. And bringing me back to this mutual therapeutic space. You know, like, it was just such a lovely conversation to get real.

Rebecca: Everything that you said is the biggest compliment that you could have given me because that’s what I strive to do is to simply be able to give people the information that I know, but also doing it in a way that they understand that if you want to know who I am, I’m just a human doing it.

Rebecca: So I can tell you the letters after my name, but they don’t actually mean very much to me, other than they’ve been able to shape my experiences of the world and of life itself to be able to, I guess translate that into some kind of language that might be able to help another person. So I’m just practising as well.

Mish: I love that like, right, so we can have lots of someone said to me like, Oh, well, you’re a better life coach, because you’re a master’s degree. And I’m like, I don’t I don’t know that that doesn’t make me a better life coach.

Mish: It just means I went to uni. And I can, you know, get conceptualise things that perhaps someone hasn’t spoken about, or I can maybe filter it in a different light, but doesn’t mean that Yeah, I’m necessarily better at something I just have a deeper maybe educational understanding of a concept doesn’t mean to actually apply it any better than anyone else.

Rebecca: Yeah, that’s right. And that also kind of speaks to the space that we’re in. That implies that there’s this sense of scarcity, about the work that we’re doing, and I don’t buy into that at all.

Rebecca: So all I’m trying to do is take the stories that I’m living and have lived and shape it with the language that I know and the theory that I know to say this is what fits for me in terms of making meaning and making understanding.

Rebecca: This is what fits for me That doesn’t mean that the world doesn’t need what you have to say or what the next person has to say about their lived experience as well. That’s why I don’t really get into, well, who am I do? I mean, do you want the bio that people get sent when they say, Can you send me a headshot and bio, I just don’t love that. Because it just it makes it makes me sounds like I have a reason for being here. That is over and above the fact that I’m just living to

Mish: Like, can we just sit in that for a minute, like the action makes me tear again, somebody will start crying again. Like, I just think that that is so beautiful. Like at the end of the day, right? This has nothing to do about bravery, or why had you on here, but the end of the day, right?

Mish: Like when I was in palliative care nursing. No one really cared what anybody was. They didn’t they actually just cared about their lived experience and all of that type of stuff. You know, like, at the end of the day, someone’s like, you know what, I really wish I would have gone and bought that PhD and blah, blah, blah.

Mish: It’s like, no, I really wish I would have been more brave, more authentic, more connected. And less stressed. All of those things like everything, when grandma always said it all comes out the washer, and it comes out on the wash. What you’re doing is so important.

Mish: So I won’t cry anymore. But let’s talk about this new book. Because I can’t wait to have it. It’s very beautiful. We get into that, can

Rebecca: Number one, I didn’t know that you did palliative care, nursing. And two. That would have been profound. And to segue into talking about brave, it just made me think exactly of my nan, who last year passed twice, right.

Rebecca: And before four months before she passed away, her my pop who she was married to for 69 years passed away in front of her.

Rebecca: So they moved into a nursing home two weeks prior to that. And they had previously lived independently in their own unit. They had a room side by side. And she sat with him in his room for every day of every hour of that two weeks.

Rebecca:  And she waited until he passed. And after he passed, I went down with her. And she said to me, darling, all that matters, in the end, is who we love, and how we love them. And for me, that is the essence of brave living.

Rebecca: It’s to accept all the horror and the brutality that we experience as humans emotionally and to say you know what, I do it all again. Because the love was worth it.

Rebecca: And that’s why we talk about bravery. Because it’s so bloody important

Mish: it’s so bloody important

Mish: It’s just sometimes I just think I’m sure you have days like this when you look at that and then you get online just like why am I swinging to like am I is any is anyone listening to this?

Mish: My god you know, like, all this time like make the perfect graphic and like have a timed and Instagram like falls apart and the whole world falls off its axis today.


Mish: Then you know one of the things that I think about the most like the most that I coach on the most that you probably work on your side therapy or you did was connection and vulnerability, right like it is the essence of humanity it is it I don’t care how much money you have.

Mish: It’s like if you cannot connect and you don’t have that connection, but it requires brave remember Berne brown talking about or to feel joy you have to feel pain, you have to be open. So why is braid so important to you?

Mish: You said to me before the podcast This is a book I’ve always wanted to write this is a book that we apart and how beautiful of your nan I mean it’s the truth it’s the essence of human connection the essence of human living is connection.

Mish: Go on about it you know kids don’t have connection by the age of three struggle almost our whole life to be connected. Those foundational neurological pathways are being formed before words. So yeah, why why brave? Why do you think brave is so important in this society and where you are right now and why this book?

Rebecca: Two different questions why brave and why this book? I’ll start with why brave and for me brave because it encompasses our full human experience. So you mentioned before we went to air that I was unhappy with the title of my book class g that came out last year it’s called be happy.

Rebecca: I didn’t choose that title. I love the book by the way, but I just wasn’t fast on the title. The publish the chosen title to, I guess appeal to a certain demographic.

Rebecca: Reasonable isn’t happy to title this because I felt like it didn’t really speak to what I believe to be the human experience, which is the full spectrum of colour of emotion. And so why brave is because brave happens in not only in every area of our lives, but in every facet of our minds and every part of our experience.

Rebecca: If you’re not doing well at the moment, and you’re in the trenches, and you’re wondering whether or not it’s worth getting up tomorrow morning, that’s brave. It’s brave to stay with yourself during that. If you’re like my brother, ridiculously thank God, he survived, but he crossed best straight for our international listeners.

Rebecca: Tasmania is a small state off the coast of mainland Australia and the water in between is called Best straight, very dangerous water and my brother crossed that straight on the stand paddleboard earlier this year was the first person to do it. And he didn’t get eaten by a shark, God love him. But for some people, that’s bravery.

Rebecca: You know, that’s what we call it. And for me is everything from the time where you sit there and you go, I have to go back to the doctor and get another another script to my antidepressants. And that makes me feel like I’m broken, but you go do it anyway.

Rebecca: Or it’s the time where you go, you know what, I’m actually giving up my nine to nine to five job and I’m opening my art studio. It doesn’t matter what it is. I’m not saying what brave needs to be. I’m saying the process is what makes life beautiful.

Mish: Interesting, I’ve never thought of brave is kind of the encompassing sentiment in a lot of things, right? Like, it’s, it kind of encompasses vulnerability and authenticity holistically.

Mish: Because it’s like that kind of one stop shop of, are you being brave in your life. And that could just be like, I’m being brave, because I’m not having to cook glasses of wine.

Mish: Tonight I’m having one I’m going to choose to sit with you. Or brave could be like, I’m gonna go put myself into like a coaching. Like, you know, 45 challenge, like, it doesn’t matter.

Mish: I love what you said about that. It’s actually relevant to you as the person, not in the context with which bravery is projected onto us as women, if that makes sense.

Mish: Yep. Exactly. One of the terms that I was talking to you about, like, literally load with like, the sweet hot intensity of 1000 blessings. it till you make it. I hate that term. Like I don’t, there’s not a terms like really get my goat. That’s not true. But that’s one I like, really don’t like because I think what it does is it’s like, what it does is it says like, Okay, well, I don’t know as much as Dr. Rebecca Ray, but you know what, I’m gonna pretend that I do until I do you know, and actually bring any sort of alignment to me at all. I’m just trying to make myself someone else.

Rebecca: Does that make sense to you? Do you see Oh, absolutely. There’s actually psychological techniques called fake it till you make it. And I have never sold them in inverted commas to my clients, because I don’t believe in them.

Rebecca: So there is something so incredibly, personally invalidating about saying if you’re feeling anxious, you need to show up to a situation and pretend that you’re not what bullshit.

Rebecca: All that does is continually telling you that your experience is wrong or abnormal, or that you’re somehow broken or defective because of it. And there are so many more effective ways that we can get to where we’re going without having to fake our way there in the first place.

Mish: It’s so true. It is it. I think it’s absolutely one of most Paramount things that I have that I coach with his bravery. Like just even, like one of them that I can think of now in a different complete different context is saying to your partner, I don’t appreciate it when you just come up and grabbing on.

Mish: Yep, like that can be really brave for someone because what it’s actually saying to that person is I need I’m gonna internalise what I need, what feels good, and then I have to verbalise out and I know I could potentially get rejected. Yeah. Like, that’s frickin brave. Absolutely.

Rebecca: I think actually, I think it’s so underrated what we do in our relationships to keep them healthy, and how brave those things are. Because to keep your relationship healthy, you need to be real. And that is hard. Like Andrew,

Mish: I want you to leave me alone, because if you don’t leave, your quality of life is going to go downhill really fast. That’s how I approach it and he’s like, Ainsley gonna get up. Do you do too?

Mish: But you know, people are like, how do you say that to your husband? Like definitely just I’m like, not like, my job is to be really brave in my recovery. Because I’m not bringing my recovery, then I am not being brave in my life. And so that’s how I look at bravery for me. So when you’re talking about bravery?

Mish: Yeah. Why do you think right now in the context that we’re in, it’s such an important topic to talk about?

Rebecca: Because I think it really speaks to the fact that were in a place where we’re told so often what we should be. Yeah. And we’re told equally as often, if not more, what we’re not usually not enough of. And being brave enables us to have some kind of way of being not some kind of, but a way of being to be able to move through all that noise to get to our true selves.

Mish: I love it. I love it. I love it so much.

Mish: When someone is starting out, like let’s say, baby brave, like, I’ve never been

Rebecca: so cute, baby brave. Oh my god.

Mish: Can you make a little kid’s book about it? there? There’s your next book.

Rebecca: No aw don’t!

Mish: But do you? I mean, like, did you oh my gosh, I saw this like little I think it was like a platypus or a hedgehog or something.

Mish: It’s, I don’t even know also, that was drinking milk out of this like syringe on this lady’s hand, though, like knows, it’s like sucking it up.

Rebecca: I was like, was this in the vortex of Instagram? You saw this?

Mish: Yeah. Before? Yeah. At the little and he’s like a shot. I’m gonna go watch Star Wars. I’m out here. I’m gonna go watch, like little platypuses or hedgehogs drink milk. But that’s baby brave.

Mish: I want a syringe feed grave, so that you can just lap it up slowly, like, so baby brave, you know, like Baby shark, you know, Baby shark. And it’s mama shark and all that.

Mish: Wait until your son is obsessed Baby shark.

Rebecca: I haven’t even heard that song. And I plan not to, like, I’m just staying away.

Mish: Wait until the indoctrination Just you wait. So what I want to say is like, how do we start with like, drinking out of the hand of bravery? How do we start as a baby brave?

Mish: What are some like little seeds that we can start to do? Because sometimes people look at that. And they think, Oh, God, I don’t even know where to start? Because I’m so like, this is so overwhelming.

Rebecca: Yep. Where do we before we even start with planting the seeds, we’re going to start with what the garden looks like. So before we even start with seeds, we haven’t even walked into the garden. And how we picture the garden is how you’re going to approach your your break.

Rebecca: And what I want to say about the garden is it’s everywhere. Yeah, so it’s Yeah, it’s not just about the seed that you plant for the next piece of content that you want to produce for your audience, or for the promotion that you want to go for at work or for, you know, saying Yes, actually, I want to try for another baby.

Rebecca: And that means that we have to go down the IVF path. It’s not necessarily the things, it’s understanding that brave exists everywhere you look, which means it’s accessible in small amounts, and really large amounts to if you want to get radical.

Rebecca: So when we talk about the garden, I want you to understand that if you’re, if you don’t feel brave at the moment, and let’s face it, who does so actually, let me clarify that before we go any further.

Rebecca: This is such a hole. But let me clarify the fact that people will say to me, oh, you know, I want to be brave. And they don’t get that it’s not about being fearless.

Rebecca: If we want to talk about things that make you want to stab yourself in the eye, fearless is one of my terms that does that. Because actually, the process of being brave means you feel scared.

Rebecca: So those two co exist no, not even before, during. So while you’re being brave, the act of being brave is scary, usually for the whole time that you’re being brave. And so when we’re talking about being brave, it’s about coming back to this place where in your life garden, you can choose what it looks like on any given day.

Rebecca: So when I was recovering from when I was pregnant, getting being brave was sometimes allowing myself to admit that the pregnancy was the most barve physical thing I’ve ever been through. Even though on social media, that’s not really acceptable.

Rebecca: I never said it out loud. And in fact, I haven’t really talked about this publicly before. Not because it’s not acceptable, but just because it was a private process that I’m coming to a place of healing about.

Rebecca: But it’s those tiny, unseen moments. That’s as much baby brave, as it is about going, you know, when you’re learning to skip when you’re in primary school, and you’re like, Do I go in now on it? Or now or now? It’s like now where you get those steps and go, am I gonna take that step next, it’s more visible, and it might be in front of people.

Rebecca: And it might be the time where you say, I’m going to go for my licence today, you know, or I’m going to go, and I’m going to learn a new language because I want to travel to Italy. Okay, we’re not Elise Gilbert, but hey, no, I mean, it’s different sizes and different tastes for different people

Mish: love it. And I think the first thing you thought about was instead of figuring out like, how to be a baby brave, the first thing you basically asked someone was, how does your garden look, which then kind of goes into Well, how do you want to feel?

Rebecca: Yeah, and where are you already being brave? Like, it’s, I think it’s about perception. It’s not about saying that tomorrow, I’m going to be brave.

Rebecca: And therefore that means than I like for I had a client that contacted me the other day, an ex client who I treated for driving phobia, and the big thing for her was driving into the city scared the crap out of her.

Rebecca: It could be bad. But also, where are you already being brave in your life garden that you could if only you reframed the experience, you could already see that brave was there? Because you are you just can’t show me a human being and tell me not to find a place where they’re already being brave.

Mish: Yeah, I think it pushes up against this idea that brave has to be big. Brave, doesn’t have to be big, it can be very small can be just a simple decision. It can be wearing a nose ring, it could be getting a tattoo, it could be, you know, saying?

Mish: No, you know, like, there’s lots of things that equal bravery. But I’ve found that as I have become more brave in my life. First of all, my boundaries are a lot stronger.

Rebecca: Yes, yes. saying no.

Mish: Yes. Yeah. So like, now I’m like, it’s kind of like you have to test it out. Like you do a little brave thing. Oh, that wasn’t so bad. So you’re like letting your brain neurochemically? Just calm down? Yeah.

Mish: Because it freaks out like, it’s our brains love comfort. We were just talking before we are very primal. We love comfort. We love sugar, we love and oxytocin. And there Yeah. So we don’t like to be in that kind of place.

Mish: We don’t know what we’re gonna be what’s gonna happen. But I think that, like you said, small bits. I love the idea of like, where you’re being brave now. Because Yeah.

Rebecca: But also, what you’re saying brings up a really important point about life expansion. So when we’re talking about baby break, and how that leads to ways of being bigger in your life showing up in a bigger way, what happens is the difference between then and there. point A and point B is confidence.

Rebecca: You don’t feel confident before you do something, you don’t feel confident before you practice. And yet you practice that thing over and over again, and your brain gets rewired to be able to take that action into your life is something that you now do.

Rebecca: That means that you feel a sense of confidence, it means that your comfort zone expands, the more things you can do, and therefore the braver in inverted commas, you feel on the way

Mish: I love that. I also just mentioned it briefly touch on this idea of like, as a parent, this is just a random thought for you to as an adult, right?

Mish: Like as a parent, I say to my daughter, okay, you know, you can go do that, like you can go you can go and do that. And the thing that we do as parents is then if they don’t want to do it, we encourage them, but if they keep saying no, we comfort them. Yeah.

Mish: As an adult woman, I have never until recently ever given myself any form of positive comfort. It was always bingeing or deprivation. dieting is an interesting concept to like, in the bravery circle, to like crank the shit out of compassion. Yep.

Rebecca: It’s kind of critical.

Mish: It is, isn’t it?

Rebecca: Yeah. If you really want to see what your potential is within your bravery that starts with self compassion. Because if you can’t be gentle with yourself in the brave process or on the brave path, you’ll quickly be stopped.

Rebecca: And you’ll be stopped by self criticism and voice the voice that completely disparages you and keeps you small and makes you quiet and then too tells you all the parts of you that are defective, and unwanted and unlovable and unworthy. That part doesn’t help you be brave.

Rebecca: We’re socialised to think the more we slap ourselves around, then surely we’ll get better. But it doesn’t work like that.

Mish: It absolutely does not. Absolutely, fundamentally does not. When you’re so baby brave, and baby self compassion. Now, there’s a really important difference here. Self Care is not self compassion.

Mish: No, self care could be a tentacle of self compassion. Yeah. But we need to be really mindful of not. How would you define self compassion? And how do you baby self compassion in your life?

Rebecca: For me, I think self-compassion is rooted in self acceptance. So it’s coming to a place where you first and foremost, accept yourself as human. And that means having both strengths and imperfections.

Rebecca: So it’s a global acceptance of your wholeness, love, and then holding that gently. The second step is to accept it, but then hold it gently, and treat yourself the way you would a friend. And I was going to say loved one, but then I quickly returned to that as friends.

Rebecca: Because I actually think that self love is a bit overwhelming at times, you know, if you’re struggling to love yourself, then if we’re going to start with baby self love, I’m easily gonna listen to this and go, Oh my god, how many babies are these girls having, um, if baby self love is too hard, you start with befriending yourself.

Rebecca: It’s actually easier to think of being friendly, speaking to yourself in a friendly way, then in a loving way, because it’s more encompassing.

Mish: I have also found too, that being brave or fake it till you make it or be fearless, on hustle, whatever you want to slapstick on, out of fear and manipulation and never works, ever. But when we come from a fluency in quote, unquote, or living in alignment, or making a brave choice, or placing boundaries of self compassion and self love and authenticity, that’s that stuff sticks. Yeah, um,

Rebecca: so an easier place to stay in way easier. Yeah, ways. It’s more natural, it’s not requiring you to turn off your emotions or turn off your thoughts in some way to be able to reach some kind of impossible states like fearlessness

Mish: Just seem to because I remember I rang a ring a online or like a disorder hotline here in Australia, which I’m not I will not name I, I truly believe myself. Maybe I’m just Junior in my my addiction recovery.

Mish: But I always have accepted that I will always have the propensity to flip the switch as an addict, always sure. And so, in my recovery, my leash is tight. It’s really tight. I have to be really mindful of how much I take on and how much stress I had, I learned that my leash gets longer, but right now my leash is tight. And I was told very clearly by one of the counsellors, you’re not recovered.

Mish: You’re not recovered, because when you’re recovered, you’re no longer an addict. I thought, isn’t that interesting that even in addiction recovery, this idea of like self acceptance and self compassion and being brave, like, I’m an addict, this is how I feel is punished.

Mish: And I think that when you were talking about that about self acceptance, it’s like, I wish that 132 kilos, Michelle could have accepted herself as lobbying worthy then as losing the weight would have not been so hellacious.

Mish: So I think self acceptance doesn’t necessarily mean that you can’t change or progress or heal. It just means right now you’re worthy in and of yourself. And you have full permission to continue to heal or continue to be healthier or continue to expand.

Rebecca: That’s the nature of self acceptance. Yeah, that there is that space and space in it if you I mean, I think some people can see self compassion is something that’s really indulgent. But it’s not a leaf pass.

Rebecca: It doesn’t mean that you get out of doing the work. It’s just a way of approaching the work. That doesn’t make it so bloody hard.

Mish: Yeah. such an important delineation. So, so important, and then I think you’re exactly right when we are self compassionate and acceptance, that our bravery ability goes up higher and when our bravery ability goes up higher than our boundaries go There are boundaries are a lot firmer, firmer, we live more authentically with more joy, like a domino, the linkage effect.

Rebecca: Yeah. And then that transfers to all our relationships. Because if you’re being a more joyful, authentic version of you, the people who love you and the people that you’re trying to love, loved more deeply.

Rebecca: So that connection becomes richer, because you’re showing up without all the walls and all the guards and all the protection that you previously needed, because your grant boundaries weren’t great. Love it.

Mish: It just has impacts on like, so many areas. So like one impact for me since working on this type of stuff is how I parent. So when I was parented, I was yelled at I was spanked, I was chased on hallways like it was dark.

Mish: Yeah, don’t use as well. Yeah, right. Yeah. So let’s just be honest here. Like, I think I’ve spent Ailey twice, I stopped when she was 18 months, it wasn’t even hard it would, and I remember her looking at me, and I’m like, Whoa, that’s not what I want to evoke with my child.

Mish: So I’ve never done ever, ever again, I will never do it. Don’t message me if you spank your children. Because, because they don’t learn from that. And we don’t learn from the same thing.

Mish: If we’re mentally hitting ourselves or abusing ourselves, we don’t learn. And so what happened was recently, she had his massive, massive tantrum, she never does. But she was just, she was so overwhelmed emotionally, just from school.

Mish: And so what I did, instead of like getting really angry, which is, you know, he just like stopped doing that just go to bed, I just sat on the floor, and I held her. And she screamed for 20 minutes in my ear, but she never let go.

Mish: Wow. And to me, that was really brave for me. Yeah. And I think if we can flip it around for ourselves when we want to meltdown, or we feel like we’re going to meltdown, if we show up with that compassion, you know?

Rebecca: oh, my God, that’s so beautiful. I come from a family who like to switch emotions off. They like to compact them away where they’re unseen. And the only emotions that are really acceptable anger, or, you know, sarcasm in the form of joking, and, you know, the classic Australian deprecating way.

Rebecca: And what that makes me think of is, how brave It is to be able to sit in the emotion that your daughter is experiencing, because that requires you to get vulnerable to now I’m not attacking my parents, because they didn’t know any better.

Rebecca: They were both taught in inverted commas by their own parents, how to deal with emotions, which was not to deal with emotions. And so for them to be able to deal with my emotions as an emotional child was not only not within their abilities, they didn’t, they literally didn’t have the skills.

Rebecca: But they also didn’t have the courage to sit and be vulnerable in the emotion for themselves, let alone with my own feelings. Because as I know, now, as a parent, I used to know this intellectually, and there are lots of things now emotionally that are only used to know intellectually since the child, which is Oh my God, why didn’t someone tell me how much this parenthood thing hurts?

Rebecca: But what I know is, I could almost make me cry thinking about it, it is so hard to see your child in pain. Yeah. And in fact, I’m not sure I’ve ever experienced anything more, anything harder. And that includes trauma, because it’s a completely different kind of thing.

Rebecca: But to watch your child in pain, and then to be brave enough to approach that pain and not run from it, and sit with it, like you did, is the most beautiful vessel we could have ever provided her.

Rebecca: That’s how we get courageous in our connections by is by coming to you not running from and it’s exactly the same for ourselves. If you’re going to be compassionate, if you’re going to be brave with yourself, you need to come to yourself, not run away. Love it.

Mish: Well, we both cried. So I think it’s so nice for coming tonight.

Mish: Make sure to drive safe home. Make sure you turn your lights on. yes to all of it. I feel like there is this hunger and I feel like we overcomplicate bravery because we think it’s like some prescriptive thing or it’s some like 15 step program or it’s some like expensive retreat in Bali or some juice cleanse it’s like it’s not that it’s literally showing up in your Kmart leggings, no bra on and greasy hair and being like I love myself today.

Mish: Yeah showing up every day. When you Have overeating or you binge or drink too much wine and be like, I’m going to show up to love myself as much as I can say it’s reading that GP, it’s going that psych appointment, it’s going to the school drop off and being nice to everyone.

Mish: Some days, you know, it’s all the all, but it can bus come from a place of self-compassion. Otherwise, it’s just another Flippin grind it Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Love it. So back. Yes. Tell me your book. Where can we get it? When is it out? I’m ordering 35,000 copies, everyone’s getting them. I send them out as gifts all the time because I love everything you do.

Mish: Thank you. So first, tell us about the book. And I wanted to make sure everyone knows how to get in contact with you online. Okay, so

Rebecca: The next book is out on the 26th of March here in Australia, for anyone listening overseas all have international real estate hails at some stage, I don’t have them right now.

Rebecca: It’s called the universe listens to brave, and my community have been sort of beautiful, and asking for years for some way that they could go where they could access all my little mantras and mantras and affirmations in one place and the universe listens to brave is it.

Rebecca: And it encompasses the areas of bravery that I love so much things like healing and building trust, and sitting with uncertainty and rising after something has happened and being able to continue on the journey. And in each of those areas, or each of those chapters of the book, you’ll find the thoughts are the inspirations that you need to be able to continue on that part of your journey.

Rebecca: So it’s a book that you’ll want to sit with. And it’s a book that you’ll want to give away as well. So I think of it as the book that I wrote for the people that I love most.

Rebecca: But it’s also the book that I wrote for myself, because I wanted somewhere that I could go where I could just open the cabinet to any page and go Actually, that’s what I needed to read today. And that’s what this book looks like.

Mish: So excited. I’m so excited. Now, Instagram and Facebook. You’re there. playing hard. Yes, that’s right. Good.

Rebecca: I don’t really play hard. I just post when I can. Let’s be real

Mish: Yeah, but you play hard in the sense that like you’re just rocking the boat. You’re not rocking the boat. You’re just kind of saying to people like look up. Look up. Yeah, just keep looking up.

Mish: Don’t you don’t have to play that game that you’ve been sold your whole life or the life the last five years? Yeah, I hope and beautiful imagery. Gorgeous. Your work? Have you been working much of listo Lissa, Maya, awesome. Whether or

Rebecca: Not recently, we haven’t done anything together. But all of all the lettering on my page lists off its lists made, she does such beautiful work, stuff, my book, and my head by amazing photographers for that credit credit in the caption and tag as well.

Rebecca: So please don’t credit any photography to me because it’s not mine. Yeah. So um, let’s be let’s be real Instagram is a lot of content. So I like to share other people’s beautiful work.

Mish: Oh, yeah, there’s so many Careers Out There. People can find you at Rebecca Today, you and you’ve got their links to the shop tab for media events, how to connect with her. And you have a new program coming up, which

Rebecca: I do. I do. I stopped writing one of the modules to come and do this interview with you right now. It’s, it will be released. I’m hoping at the end of April. It’s called radical courage transforming fear into freedom.

Rebecca: And I don’t feel like I’ve ever been so aligned in creating something for my community except for writing my books until now.

Rebecca: It’s just I can’t I don’t even have words for it. It’s I’m sorry in it and I just cannot wait to share it with people because I think it’s going to turn brave into something that’s a lived experience for them.

Mish: You are a gift. You’re such a gift. So we thank you. Thank you for your time.

Rebecca: This my life right now. Thank you for having me. I really did need to be torn away from the rest of it’s waiting for me right beside my keyboard.

Mish: It will always be waiting as an entrepreneur creative. It’s never done. The work has been ever. What a joy.

Rebecca: What a joy to have this as the work you know. So true.

Mish: Everyone go check her out Rebecca Ray  You’re amazing. I’m so grateful for you. I’m so grateful for your voice and your courage and I cannot wait to have you on again to talk about whatever else you’re really saying to the world. So thank you again, so much.

Thanks, Mish. Thank you for having me. Lovely once I Hope you enjoyed that conversation with the remarkable Mish Pope as much as I did. If you’d like to dive into the topics that we discussed in a little more depth, I have a stack of free resources for you at Rebecca forward/free.

I’ll catch you next week for the next episode of Hello, Rebecca Ray. Lovely ones. Thank you so much for listening to Hello, Rebecca Ray.

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